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Hmong & Chinese Connection


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#1
ChivKeeb

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Mej Mej saib - leej twg kawm leej twg lug!
Qas Suav quas Moob puas sib Thooj...

It was generally accepted that western Hmong
languages contain approximate 15% Chinese. But
according to my reasearch, more than 55% Hmong
words had rooted in Chinese.

Or should I say, some 30% Chinese are rooted
in Hmong? There is no conclusive proof as to
who had borrowed from whom, so far!

What do you think?

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#2
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Koj yeej yog muaj povthawj zoo kawg lawm mog.
ua li koj puas paub lug suav?

#3
Vajhuamsibluag

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Tsis muaj tias Hmoob yuav qiv lus ntawm lwm haiv neeg los. Ntuj tsim teb raug Hmoob nyob qabntuj. Hmoob yeej txawj hais Hmoob lus. Chivkeeb ntiajteb tsuas muaj dej, nrojtsuag thiab blej/mov xwb. Mov je dej txias thiab je zaub tsuag yog Hmoob tug! Ib qho ntawm Hmoob txoj kev r uam yog kev xyaum testaw. Yus txawj yus tug los tseem hu ua "Kung Fu". Hmoob pluag lus kawg! :angry:

Edited by Vahuamsibluag, 09 January 2010 - 11:40 AM.

Vajhuamsibluag


Consistency kev sau ntawv Hmoob:
H always comes after all consonants, except HMOOB.

Lhoov Tshiab:

B = NP
J = NTS
NX = NTX
G = NK
^ = Xn while n = any number > 1 (in this standard) (Coob^ = Coob2 = Coob Coob)

Siv tus (-) los txuas compound words: Tu-siab, ja-iab, Nyab-laj, mam-li, etc.


#4
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 Vahuamsibluag, on 09 January 2010 - 11:39 AM, said:

Tsis muaj tias Hmoob yuav qiv lus ntawm lwm haiv neeg los. Ntuj tsim teb raug Hmoob nyob qabntuj. Hmoob yeej txawj hais Hmoob lus. Chivkeeb ntiajteb tsuas muaj dej, nrojtsuag thiab blej/mov xwb. Mov je dej txias thiab je zaub tsuag yog Hmoob tug! Ib qho ntawm Hmoob txoj kev r uam yog kev xyaum testaw. Yus txawj yus tug los tseem hu ua "Kung Fu". Hmoob pluag lus kawg! :angry:

Nyob zoo Xeev Txwj Zeej Laug; Vahuamsibluag,

Koj has los yeej yog kawg, xaav kuas muab tau povthawj lug txheem
mas yuav khov dlua. Kuv los yeej xaav ibyaam le koj has hab, tabsis
kuv muaj povthawj ntau taw txug tej lug Moob thooj lug Suav. Puas
yuav yog ob hom tuabneeg nuav, lub hauvpaug koom ib tsob ncau lug
moog?

Yug Moob le ibtxwm has ntawm ncauj tshwm ntawm ntswg, yaam dlaab
tsi twb tsi muaj lug txheem, los Moob hastas siv nyog tau! Tug cujpwm
nuav nyob ruaj caag rua Moob tug xyw - yog tsi hloov, Moob yeej
yuav tsi tshwm neej zoo!

Koj saib ntxiv mas.... ua ntej yuav muab tau qhov tseeb, yuav yog
rov taug lw, taug tug neev - txheeb, nrhav, tshawb kuas pum ntau
le ntau - maam le luj, ntsuag - txhajle yuav ze rua qhov ncaaj!

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 Vahuamsibluag, on 09 January 2010 - 11:39 AM, said:

Tsis muaj tias Hmoob yuav qiv lus ntawm lwm haiv neeg los. Ntuj tsim teb raug Hmoob nyob qabntuj. Hmoob yeej txawj hais Hmoob lus. Chivkeeb ntiajteb tsuas muaj dej, nrojtsuag thiab blej/mov xwb. Mov je dej txias thiab je zaub tsuag yog Hmoob tug! Ib qho ntawm Hmoob txoj kev r uam yog kev xyaum testaw. Yus txawj yus tug los tseem hu ua "Kung Fu". Hmoob pluag lus kawg! :angry:

Vahuamsibluag,

Kuv jeeg koj tij tias Hmoob yeej muaj Hmoob Lus.

Sob lus hauv qab no yog lus Hmoob, nrog Hmoob txoj sia ua NEEG.

==> KEEB TIV HAUV PAUS LUB NTUJ TSIM TEB RAUG YEEJ XEEB TXAWM MUAJ NQAIJ HMOOB NYOB NTIAJ TEB QAB NTUJ KHWB.

Hmoob tsis pluag lus os..! "Kung Fu"(lus suav)= "Lawjxeeb"(lusHmoob"


Jibdua,

#6
ChivKeeb

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 THM, on 09 January 2010 - 01:32 PM, said:

Vahuamsibluag,

Kuv jeeg koj tij tias Hmoob yeej muaj Hmoob Lus.

Sob lus hauv qab no yog lus Hmoob, nrog Hmoob txoj sia ua NEEG.

==> KEEB TIV HAUV PAUS LUB NTUJ TSIM TEB RAUG YEEJ XEEB TXAWM MUAJ NQAIJ HMOOB NYOB NTIAJ TEB QAB NTUJ KHWB.

Hmoob tsis pluag lus os..! "Kung Fu"(lus suav)= "Lawjxeeb"(lusHmoob"


Jibdua,

Nyob Zoo Rua Meb Obtug Kwvluag,

Zoo le kuv saib meb siv cov ntawv Moob txawv zog kuv, kuj zoo lawm ib yaam.
Meb ob leeg ntseeg hastas Moob muaj Moob lug siv... Kuv paub hastas Moob
yeej muaj Moob lug sib - yog yug paub lawm tsi tog yuav ntseeg le, nwg yeej
nyob ntawd hab yeej yog qhov tseeb. Koj yuav ntseeg hab tsi ntseeg los yeej
tsi hloov qhov tseeb tau.

Qhov kuv has mas leej twg los yeej paub tas, Moob yeej muaj Moob lug - ib yaam
le txhua haivneeg, nyag muaj nyag lug xws nkaus.

Qhov meb yuav tau qha kuv mas yog, vim le caag yuav muaj lug Moob thooj lug
Suav ntau le ntau? Yog hastas Moob muaj Moob lug, Suav muaj Suav lug - yuav
uacaag txhais tau qhov sib thooj? Sim qha kuv saib, leej twg kawm leej twg lug?

Ua zoo tsom qhov tseeb, ua zoo saib qhov yog - qhov tseeb koj txawm tsi ntseeg
los yeej muaj tseeb - qhov yog, koj txawm tsi ntseeg los nwg yeej yog nwg le!
Lub nub tsi yog yuav ncig lub Nplajteb, yog lub Nplajteb ncig lawv lub nub.

Meb saib ntxiv...

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 07 January 2010 - 02:34 PM, said:

Mej Mej saib - leej twg kawm leej twg lug!
Qas Suav quas Moob puas sib Thooj...

It was generally accepted that western Hmong
languages contain approximate 15% Chinese. But
according to my reasearch, more than 55% Hmong
words had rooted in Chinese.

Or should I say, some 30% Chinese are rooted
in Hmong? There is no conclusive proof as to
who had borrowed from whom, so far!

What do you think?

mmmm kuv xav mas Hmoob yeej tsis tau qev lus los kawm Suav lus hais li raws li koj sau hauv no koj sau suav cov lus thiab Hmoob cov lus mas txawv lawm tsis sib xws nas, yog ho muaj tej lo yuav sib xws ntawd los tsuas zoo ib yam li lus English,lus Fab kis thiab lus Mexican xwb.

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 10 January 2010 - 10:52 AM, said:

Nyob Zoo Rua Meb Obtug Kwvluag,

Zoo le kuv saib meb siv cov ntawv Moob txawv zog kuv, kuj zoo lawm ib yaam.
Meb ob leeg ntseeg hastas Moob muaj Moob lug siv... Kuv paub hastas Moob
yeej muaj Moob lug sib - yog yug paub lawm tsi tog yuav ntseeg le, nwg yeej
nyob ntawd hab yeej yog qhov tseeb. Koj yuav ntseeg hab tsi ntseeg los yeej
tsi hloov qhov tseeb tau.

Qhov kuv has mas leej twg los yeej paub tas, Moob yeej muaj Moob lug - ib yaam
le txhua haivneeg, nyag muaj nyag lug xws nkaus.

Qhov meb yuav tau qha kuv mas yog, vim le caag yuav muaj lug Moob thooj lug
Suav ntau le ntau? Yog hastas Moob muaj Moob lug, Suav muaj Suav lug - yuav
uacaag txhais tau qhov sib thooj? Sim qha kuv saib, leej twg kawm leej twg lug?

Ua zoo tsom qhov tseeb, ua zoo saib qhov yog - qhov tseeb koj txawm tsi ntseeg
los yeej muaj tseeb - qhov yog, koj txawm tsi ntseeg los nwg yeej yog nwg le!
Lub nub tsi yog yuav ncig lub Nplajteb, yog lub Nplajteb ncig lawv lub nub.

Meb saib ntxiv...


Chivkeebfuamyuaj,

Koj puas paub lub jiab lolus Hmoob tias "TSWV YIM" ma..? feem ntau peb Hmoob ib txhia lam hais hais tswv yim xwb, tab sis twb tsis paub tias tswv yim ne yog abtsi tiag tiag?

Tswv yim yog peb Hmoob li 8 tsav twj, sawv tuav Hmoob lub be(npe,)cia kuv muaj caij kuv mam tuaj sau Hmoob li tswv 1, tswv 2, tswv 3 mus kom txog rau tswv 8 (tswv yim) rau nej ib txhia kom paub txog lub jiab lolus "TSWV YIM"

Kuv paub tseeb tias peb Hmoob feem ntau yeej tsis muaj leej twg paub txog "TSWV YIM" lam muab tswv yim lolus coj los hais ua si xwb yeej tsis tau paub txog qhov tseeb.

Peb ib txhia Hmoob muab tswv yim txhais li no xwv,

tswv yim = idea, (this is wrong...!)nws tsis raug.

idea= peb lus Hmoob yog "xeev xav," (tsis yog tswv yim.)

Piv txwv xws, Hmoob lolus "Mis" yuav raug rau Meskas lolus "Milk" yeej txhais ib yam nkaus li ntag..!
Tabsis yeej tsis muaj Meskas yuav tias Hmoob txeeb Meskas li lus hais lossis Hmoob yuav hais tias Meskas txeeb Hmoob lus hais, qhov nov vim Puag thaum ub lub ntuj tsim teb raug los Hmoob thiab Meskas yeej tsis tau sib jib sib pom li nyias yeej hais hais nyias lus "MIS" thiab "MILK" los lawm puag thaum ntuj cheev keeb los lawm, nyias yeej muaj nyias li lus hais tiag...!!

Tej zaum nej ib txhia kawm kawm ntawv suav thiab lus suav ces lus suav thiab lus Hmoob muaj tej lo ntawm lub suab kuj yuav zoo sib xws tseem tsawv ces nej cia li muab hais tias "Hmoob hais Suav lus"
Qhov tiag Hmoob yeej muaj Hmoob lus hais tiag tiag, lus Hmoob thiab lus Suav tej zaum lub suab lus yuav sibthooj tseem tsawv tabsis lolus txhab txhais nws sib txawv lawm, qhov no kom s/d thoobtsib txog.

Yog kuv yuav hais lus Hmoob theem siab rau nej mloog hauv nov ces nej yeej hais tias kuv hais Suav lus nkaus no xwb tiag..! vim kuv paub tseeb lawm tias peb Hmoob kawm Hmoob ntawv thiab kawm Hmoob lus tsis mus deb thiab siab kiag li. peb lus Hmoob tsis tau yog tas rau cov nyuag peb niaj hnub hais nov nawb, peb tseem hais lus me nyuam yaus tug nkaus xwb xwb ces peb twb xav tias peb txawj lus Hmoob tas nrho lawm no, qhov tiag peb tshuav lus Hmoob ntau li ntau rau theem txheej siab peb yeej kawm tsis tau txog kiag li, qhov teeb meem no ib txhia Hmoob thiaj pheej hais tias "Hmoob Tsis Muaj Lus Hais"

Yog xav paub lus Hmoob tiag yuav tsum mus kawm Hmoob ntawv..!

Jibdua,

#9
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 Guest, on 10 January 2010 - 11:49 AM, said:

mmmm kuv xav mas Hmoob yeej tsis tau qev lus los kawm Suav lus hais li raws li koj sau hauv no koj sau suav cov lus thiab Hmoob cov lus mas txawv lawm tsis sib xws nas, yog ho muaj tej lo yuav sib xws ntawd los tsuas zoo ib yam li lus English,lus Fab kis thiab lus Mexican xwb.


Yes Guest,

Zoo le peb cov Moob feem coob, yog tsi paub txug dlaab tsi lawm
txawm play dumb - ignorant. This mentality won't point to the fact
that we are intelligent at all!

Linguistically, Spanish, English, French and German all rooted
and borrowed heavily in and from Latin & Greek, the languages of
the the Greek and Roman empires - as most European languages do,
and that's the fact. As we know, Lao & Thais do borrowed heavily
from Pali and Sanscrete. Even as Japanese & Korean do rooted in
Chinese also.

Now, peb Moob can ignore the fact that linguistically and culturally
we are so pure - that we actually pioneered a languages and culture
so advance that we have no need to borrow from any source. On the
contrary, everything that Moob do today reflect influences of
Imperial China.

Nowaday, it's scientifically proven that, no pure human race existed
in this world. And let me pointed out that Moob had no DNA affiliation
with Mongolian as many insisted that Mongolia was a former Moob homeland,
but contain the M1 and M2 strain of both northern and southern Chinese DNA.

So don't be so ignorant and too proud of something that don't even belong
to you at all, yet openly explore and see what may possibly be closer to
the truth.

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#10
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 THM, on 10 January 2010 - 03:29 PM, said:

Chivkeebfuamyuaj,

Koj puas paub lub jiab lolus Hmoob tias "TSWV YIM" ma..? feem ntau peb Hmoob ib txhia lam hais hais tswv yim xwb, tab sis twb tsis paub tias tswv yim ne yog abtsi tiag tiag?

Tswv yim yog peb Hmoob li 8 tsav twj, sawv tuav Hmoob lub be(npe,)cia kuv muaj caij kuv mam tuaj sau Hmoob li tswv 1, tswv 2, tswv 3 mus kom txog rau tswv 8 (tswv yim) rau nej ib txhia kom paub txog lub jiab lolus "TSWV YIM"

Kuv paub tseeb tias peb Hmoob feem ntau yeej tsis muaj leej twg paub txog "TSWV YIM" lam muab tswv yim lolus coj los hais ua si xwb yeej tsis tau paub txog qhov tseeb.

Peb ib txhia Hmoob muab tswv yim txhais li no xwv,

tswv yim = idea, (this is wrong...!)nws tsis raug.

idea= peb lus Hmoob yog "xeev xav," (tsis yog tswv yim.)

Piv txwv xws, Hmoob lolus "Mis" yuav raug rau Meskas lolus "Milk" yeej txhais ib yam nkaus li ntag..!
Tabsis yeej tsis muaj Meskas yuav tias Hmoob txeeb Meskas li lus hais lossis Hmoob yuav hais tias Meskas txeeb Hmoob lus hais, qhov nov vim Puag thaum ub lub ntuj tsim teb raug los Hmoob thiab Meskas yeej tsis tau sib jib sib pom li nyias yeej hais hais nyias lus "MIS" thiab "MILK" los lawm puag thaum ntuj cheev keeb los lawm, nyias yeej muaj nyias li lus hais tiag...!!

Tej zaum nej ib txhia kawm kawm ntawv suav thiab lus suav ces lus suav thiab lus Hmoob muaj tej lo ntawm lub suab kuj yuav zoo sib xws tseem tsawv ces nej cia li muab hais tias "Hmoob hais Suav lus"
Qhov tiag Hmoob yeej muaj Hmoob lus hais tiag tiag, lus Hmoob thiab lus Suav tej zaum lub suab lus yuav sibthooj tseem tsawv tabsis lolus txhab txhais nws sib txawv lawm, qhov no kom s/d thoobtsib txog.

Yog kuv yuav hais lus Hmoob theem siab rau nej mloog hauv nov ces nej yeej hais tias kuv hais Suav lus nkaus no xwb tiag..! vim kuv paub tseeb lawm tias peb Hmoob kawm Hmoob ntawv thiab kawm Hmoob lus tsis mus deb thiab siab kiag li. peb lus Hmoob tsis tau yog tas rau cov nyuag peb niaj hnub hais nov nawb, peb tseem hais lus me nyuam yaus tug nkaus xwb xwb ces peb twb xav tias peb txawj lus Hmoob tas nrho lawm no, qhov tiag peb tshuav lus Hmoob ntau li ntau rau theem txheej siab peb yeej kawm tsis tau txog kiag li, qhov teeb meem no ib txhia Hmoob thiaj pheej hais tias "Hmoob Tsis Muaj Lus Hais"

Yog xav paub lus Hmoob tiag yuav tsum mus kawm Hmoob ntawv..!

Jibdua,

Zoo sab rua koj cov lug,

Cov ntawv kuv tso txuam nrug ntawv Suav & English tsi yog kuv sau,
kuv tsuas tso tug ntawv Moob coj lug phim rua xwb. Yog ib qho povthawj
kws English txhais Suav lug - lu lug hab lub ntsab lug kuj thooj
Moob le!

Yog koj txawj tag coj tuaj pav rua ibtsoom tau paub, puab yuav ua koj tsaug.

(Tsi yog kuv hastas - Moob borrowed Suav lug. Kuv hastas ua caag muaj feem
sib thooj ntau le ntau? Puas yog quas Moob qas Suav muaj kev sib hum
qhov twg?)

sim pav tuaj,

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 10 January 2010 - 04:20 PM, said:

Zoo sab rua koj cov lug,

Cov ntawv kuv tso txuam nrug ntawv Suav & English tsi yog kuv sau,
kuv tsuas tso tug ntawv Moob coj lug phim rua xwb. Yog ib qho povthawj
kws English txhais Suav lug - lu lug hab lub ntsab lug kuj thooj
Moob le!

Yog koj txawj tag coj tuaj pav rua ibtsoom tau paub, puab yuav ua koj tsaug.

(Tsi yog kuv hastas - Moob borrowed Suav lug. Kuv hastas ua caag muaj feem
sib thooj ntau le ntau? Puas yog quas Moob qas Suav muaj kev sib hum
qhov twg?)

sim pav tuaj,



Kuv pom zoo nej cov lug tso no. Lug hmoob yeej muaj lug suav ntau, cov Hmoob hais lus suav tsis meej xav hais tias tsis yog lus suav. Hmoob yuav tau kawm lus suav thiaj tsheej nyog tau Hmoob lub neej. Tuaj tsham suav teb, kuv mam qhia nej saib lus suav lug hmoob thooj li cas.

ua tsaug

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 Miao tzu, on 14 January 2010 - 12:46 PM, said:

Kuv pom zoo nej cov lug tso no. Lug hmoob yeej muaj lug suav ntau, cov Hmoob hais lus suav tsis meej xav hais tias tsis yog lus suav. Hmoob yuav tau kawm lus suav thiaj tsheej nyog tau Hmoob lub neej. Tuaj tsham suav teb, kuv mam qhia nej saib lus suav lug hmoob thooj li cas.

ua tsaug

Yawg ChivKeeb

kuv los yeej pom li hais lawm thiab. Koj cov lus hais tau muaj ceem zog lawm, ua rau cov Hmoob laus lawv tsis tau muaj kev xav, los yog kawm txuj txheej siab ces lawv txawm tsis nyiam nrog koj tham. Hmoob mas nyiam hais lus zoo zoo xwb, yus txawm paub los yuav tau ua zoo li yus tsis paub dab tsis li, mas Hmoob thiaj hwm yus.

Yog yug hais caj nraim ces txawm chob chob Hmoob lub hlwb noj qab tiamsis tsis paub lub hau.  Kuv yeej txheeb los lawm thiab yeej paub tias tej lus Hmoob ua koj hais no yeej muaj lub hauvpaus lus Suav nyob rau ntau li ntau. Tsis tas li Hmoob tus kev cai kiag los yeej tsom lawv suav tus model los ua thiab.

Piv xyam li, Hmoob lostsuas pov pob thiab khi tes. Hmoob nyob lwm lub tebchaws yeej tsis muaj tej no li. Qhov yog Hmoob yuav tsis lees hais tias Hmoob xyaum Nplog tus model los ua ces Hmoob yeej ignorant heev lawm tiag. Tsis tas li, cov Hmoob Phaj hauj los muab lus suav los hais ua dog ua dig tsis mauj qab tsis muaj hau li. Yam li lawm hais ua zwj hnub. zwj hli, zwj kuab, zwj caag tej no puavleej siv los lus suav Ri = lub hnub, coj los hais xwb.

Peb cov Hmoob yeej nyiam qhov tsis yog xwb, qhov yog mas yeej nyom tas mus li os nawb. YUAV HNUB TWG peb thiaj mam pom ib phaum neeg tshib los coj Hmoob lub neej mus tom ntej?

#13
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 me nyuam yau, on 15 January 2010 - 01:12 PM, said:

Yawg ChivKeeb

kuv los yeej pom li hais lawm thiab. Koj cov lus hais tau muaj ceem zog lawm, ua rau cov Hmoob laus lawv tsis tau muaj kev xav, los yog kawm txuj txheej siab ces lawv txawm tsis nyiam nrog koj tham. Hmoob mas nyiam hais lus zoo zoo xwb, yus txawm paub los yuav tau ua zoo li yus tsis paub dab tsis li, mas Hmoob thiaj hwm yus.

Yog yug hais caj nraim ces txawm chob chob Hmoob lub hlwb noj qab tiamsis tsis paub lub hau.  Kuv yeej txheeb los lawm thiab yeej paub tias tej lus Hmoob ua koj hais no yeej muaj lub hauvpaus lus Suav nyob rau ntau li ntau. Tsis tas li Hmoob tus kev cai kiag los yeej tsom lawv suav tus model los ua thiab.

Piv xyam li, Hmoob lostsuas pov pob thiab khi tes. Hmoob nyob lwm lub tebchaws yeej tsis muaj tej no li. Qhov yog Hmoob yuav tsis lees hais tias Hmoob xyaum Nplog tus model los ua ces Hmoob yeej ignorant heev lawm tiag. Tsis tas li, cov Hmoob Phaj hauj los muab lus suav los hais ua dog ua dig tsis mauj qab tsis muaj hau li. Yam li lawm hais ua zwj hnub. zwj hli, zwj kuab, zwj caag tej no puavleej siv los lus suav Ri = lub hnub, coj los hais xwb.

Peb cov Hmoob yeej nyiam qhov tsis yog xwb, qhov yog mas yeej nyom tas mus li os nawb. YUAV HNUB TWG peb thiaj mam pom ib phaum neeg tshib los coj Hmoob lub neej mus tom ntej?


Nyob zoo ob tug phooj ywg kwvluag Moob,
Zoo sab meb obtug kwvluag los tseem pum moog seem yog le kuv pum hab.
Has tseeb Moo blub mentalitly mas yog ib lub ceeblaaj yuav xaam tau
txug qhov vaammeej le.  Tsom lawv le tej zej tsoom ua guest tuaj huv
Hmongza nua xwb ces peb yeej nyoj tau lawm tas, Moob nyam ngaug –
tsi nyam ncaaj. Qhov twg ncaaj, yaam twg yog ces Moob ntxub! Txuj twg
Moob tsis paub ces Moob ua R.UAM (ignorant). Just like an Ostrich burried
its head in the dirt, as not to see its impending death!

Kuv muab ib qhov tseeb lug ua pivtxwv le ntawm nuav;
Muaj txha Moob kheev caam hastas Moob tsuas muaj 18 xeem xwb,puab tsi kaam
leeg, los ua txuj tsi paub cov Moob lwm lub xeem le lawm! – qhov tseeb,
nyob huv lub zog Moj lis Phub, Paajtawg teb nkaus xwb, Moob twb muaj
33 xeem lwm.  Puab hastas cov xeem kws tshaaj 18 xeem lawm mas yog xeem
Suav lawm xwb.

The Truth is;
1. – Moob zaaj lug nruag ob muagnug sib yuav tomqaab dlej dlaag nyaab
nplajteb mas tsuas has txug 12 xeem  xwb, twb has tsi txug 18 xeem.
Ua le 18 xeem yog lug qhovtwg lug?

1. – a. Txhua lub xeem Moob puavleej yog xeem Suav taag. Thaum Moob swb r.og
rua Suav, Suav kuav Moob lug ua pejxeem. Thaum sau npe, cov Nom Suav muab
Moob ua tsheej kaab moog cim npe, ib yim Moob twg raug faib moog tso npe
rua tug Nom Suav twg txawm caj moog coj tug Nom Suav ntawm xeem. Ua le ib yim
Moob txawm nraug ua ntau xeem Suav lug lawm.

   - b. Muaj txha Moob txheej thau tau muaj txhajntsig rua faajtim fuabtais
Suav, luas muab laj a pub rua yawm Moob ntawm, txawm caj moog ua lub xeem
fuabtais ntawm lawm hab.

  - c. Nyob Kimtsawb Suav teb, cov Moob xeem Ma, xeem Zhang, hab Xeem Looj
los ho koom ib lub qhua Zaag! Cov Moob xeem  Theej, xeem Koo, hab xeem Hooj
thaum hauvpaug twb yog ibyim ib cuab kwvtij Moob vwj.

3. – Moob saab nub poob saib lub xeem mas tseemceeb kawg kag, xaam ua kwv
ua tij, sib txheeb sib ze. Tej tub tej ntxhais mas txwv tuag nthi, sib yuav
tsi nyog hlo.

HAS TXUG MOOB SIV TEJ XEEM SUAV NUAV XWB MAS twb txaus peb xaav kawg lawm,
tabsis muaj txha Moob kws noj qaab xwb tsi paub hau, los yog ua xem xav xwb
tsi muaj tswvyim mas tseem yuav luag yug hab no huas!

Has txug ntawm Moob khaws luas lwm hom tuabneeg le kaablig kev cai, hab lug has
coj lug siv mas muaj povthawj ntau, suav tsi txheeb. Tabsis cov Moob nyom nyom
kuv nuav mas, puab hastas puab vaammeej heev, kuv twb paub tsis cuag puab!
Ua le nua, pov pob le koj tau has lug, yog Moob puj koob yawm txwv tsim kag
lug lod? Ua caag Moob nyob Tuamtshoj ho tsi paub pov ib lub pob ne?
Moob Lostsuas khi teg ua quas npaab mas dlawb vog, Moob nyog lwm tebchaws ho
tsis paub ua le? Moob Lostsuab twb muab Nplog le Basi lug khi teg – tsom lug
ua tug model coj lug siv muaj plhu ntxag lawm. COV MOOB caam caam kuv tseem
has tas, Moob mast sis tsawg ib txuj kev vaammeej le nawb!

ZOO LE COV MOOB NUAV VAAM MEEJ DLEB KAWG LE LAWM SUB LAS AS! HAS LUG TXHAM TSIS MUAJ
POVTHAWJ QAAB HAU DLAAB TSI LE – tej zag yog puab tsi muaj TSWV YIM xwb os yuam

Saib ntxiv! Yeej hab Ceev...

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 Vahuamsibluag, on 09 January 2010 - 11:39 AM, said:

Tsis muaj tias Hmoob yuav qiv lus ntawm lwm haiv neeg los. Ntuj tsim teb raug Hmoob nyob qabntuj. Hmoob yeej txawj hais Hmoob lus. Chivkeeb ntiajteb tsuas muaj dej, nrojtsuag thiab blej/mov xwb. Mov je dej txias thiab je zaub tsuag yog Hmoob tug! Ib qho ntawm Hmoob txoj kev r uam yog kev xyaum testaw. Yus txawj yus tug los tseem hu ua "Kung Fu". Hmoob pluag lus kawg! :angry:


Vahuamsibluag,

Zoo sab koj tug laug tsi leeg paub tej lug Moob thooj Suav nuav. Ib co paub lawm lod puab yuav uatxuj le ub le nuav, tabsis tsis ua le caag!

Ntawm nuav peb saib txug ob lu lug Suav, Moob txeev has kaam, saib mej xaav le caag? Puas ntxim muaj qhov thooj hab?

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#15
maixiong_vg

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    Nyob zoo txais tos sawv daws los ua phooj ywg :)

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 10 January 2010 - 04:06 PM, said:

Yes Guest,

Zoo le peb cov Moob feem coob, yog tsi paub txug dlaab tsi lawm
txawm play dumb - ignorant. This mentality won't point to the fact
that we are intelligent at all!

Linguistically, Spanish, English, French and German all rooted
and borrowed heavily in and from Latin & Greek, the languages of
the the Greek and Roman empires - as most European languages do,
and that's the fact. As we know, Lao & Thais do borrowed heavily
from Pali and Sanscrete. Even as Japanese & Korean do rooted in
Chinese also.

Now, peb Moob can ignore the fact that linguistically and culturally
we are so pure - that we actually pioneered a languages and culture
so advance that we have no need to borrow from any source. On the
contrary, everything that Moob do today reflect influences of
Imperial China.

Nowaday, it's scientifically proven that, no pure human race existed
in this world. And let me pointed out that Moob had no DNA affiliation
with Mongolian as many insisted that Mongolia was a former Moob homeland,
but contain the M1 and M2 strain of both northern and southern Chinese DNA.

So don't be so ignorant and too proud of something that don't even belong
to you at all, yet openly explore and see what may possibly be closer to
the truth.


Bro puas yog koj major linguistics thiab naj zoo li koj skill rau sab no kawg li thaib :D
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 maixiong_vg, on 29 January 2010 - 11:15 AM, said:

Bro puas yog koj major linguistics thiab naj zoo li koj skill rau sab no kawg li thaib :D


Maivxiong_vg,

Kuv tsi major linguistics tabsis kuv kawm lug paab txhaab kuv kev totaub txug teg num kuv yuav siv, yog ib lub subject yuavtsum tau paub txhaj taug nyog kev nrug txujci neeg tam tshab.

Qhov kuv major mas...... um... ab tsi laam qha koj tsaam koj paub kuv quas ceg qais has tas ........... taag lawm!

Kuv tseem sim (nyob huv hmongza nuav) xwb saib puas yuav muab tau ibtug zoo Hypothesis rua ib qho kev research. Kuv tub tsom pum lawm, cov tuaj huv nuav laaj muaj ibtug yuav muab tau ib yaam tseemceeb has txug saab SPIRITUAL.

Koj sim moog saib kuv lub topic; SPIRITUAL AWAKENING saib tub tsis attract ib nyuas kaab los nyuas Moob le!!!

He he he zag nuav koj paub, ua caag kuv hawb hawb tuaj tom koj pobtw lawm!!!  

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maixiong_vg

maixiong_vg

    Nyob zoo txais tos sawv daws los ua phooj ywg :)

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 29 January 2010 - 10:30 PM, said:

Maivxiong_vg,

Kuv tsi major linguistics tabsis kuv kawm lug paab txhaab kuv kev totaub txug teg num kuv yuav siv, yog ib lub subject yuavtsum tau paub txhaj taug nyog kev nrug txujci neeg tam tshab.

Qhov kuv major mas...... um... ab tsi laam qha koj tsaam koj paub kuv quas ceg qais has tas ........... taag lawm!

Kuv tseem sim (nyob huv hmongza nuav) xwb saib puas yuav muab tau ibtug zoo Hypothesis rua ib qho kev research. Kuv tub tsom pum lawm, cov tuaj huv nuav laaj muaj ibtug yuav muab tau ib yaam tseemceeb has txug saab SPIRITUAL.

Koj sim moog saib kuv lub topic; SPIRITUAL AWAKENING saib tub tsis attract ib nyuas kaab los nyuas Moob le!!!

He he he zag nuav koj paub, ua caag kuv hawb hawb tuaj tom koj pobtw lawm!!!


Bro yog ke koj yuav moog ua research txug moob tej kaab lis kev cai rua peg tuam tshoj nuav zoo kawg mas, txawm kuv yuav paab kooj daab tsis tsis tau los txhob ua sab deb hab thaum twg koj phau ntawv tav lawm ncu ntsoov copy ib phoo pub rua kuv hab nawb.

Tus Bro aw! tej thaum yug expect daab tsis zog lawm kuj yuav hopeless hav, yuav tsum txhob expect ntau ntau txhaj le ntsib huas hab txha le tsis hawb hawb os :lol:

Bro kojlub Topic SPIRITUAL AWAKENING nybo qhov twg nej?
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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 10 January 2010 - 04:06 PM, said:

Yes Guest,

Zoo le peb cov Moob feem coob, yog tsi paub txug dlaab tsi lawm
txawm play dumb - ignorant. This mentality won't point to the fact
that we are intelligent at all!

Linguistically, Spanish, English, French and German all rooted
and borrowed heavily in and from Latin & Greek, the languages of
the the Greek and Roman empires - as most European languages do,
and that's the fact. As we know, Lao & Thais do borrowed heavily
from Pali and Sanscrete. Even as Japanese & Korean do rooted in
Chinese also.

Now, peb Moob can ignore the fact that linguistically and culturally
we are so pure - that we actually pioneered a languages and culture
so advance that we have no need to borrow from any source. On the
contrary, everything that Moob do today reflect influences of
Imperial China.

Nowaday, it's scientifically proven that, no pure human race existed
in this world. And let me pointed out that Moob had no DNA affiliation
with Mongolian as many insisted that Mongolia was a former Moob homeland,
but contain the M1 and M2 strain of both northern and southern Chinese DNA.

So don't be so ignorant and too proud of something that don't even belong
to you at all, yet openly explore and see what may possibly be closer to
the truth.


Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Kuv xaav nug koj ib lus nawb. When you mentioned "Mongolia",I have a story to share with you my bro.
It seems like you know history well. Long ago when I was about 7 or 10 years old. This old Hmong man
came to our house and he started telling folklore stories to young children around the bonfire. He
said that many centuries ago a very pretty Hmong girl name "Maum Nkauj Liag or Maum Nkauj Lig" married a prince and later
on that country become known as Mongolia.

Do you agree? Did you know anything about it? Thank you.


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 Tub Soj Ntsuam, on 30 January 2010 - 11:18 AM, said:

Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Kuv xaav nug koj ib lus nawb. When you mentioned "Mongolia",I have a story to share with you my bro.
It seems like you know history well. Long ago when I was about 7 or 10 years old. This old Hmong man
came to our house and he started telling folklore stories to young children around the bonfire. He
said that many centuries ago a very pretty Hmong girl name "Maum Nkauj Liag or Maum Nkauj Lig" married a prince and later
on that country become known as Mongolia.

Do you agree? Did you know anything about it? Thank you.



Bro Tub Soj Ntsuam,

At this specific moment, I can't bring the piece of research in regard Hmong and Mongolia. But, I promise to bring it here when I found it. Because, I think the idea of Mongolia has anything to do with Hmong is all bullshit, and that's TRUE!


Mongolia, is how it was written in English. And Hmong think, it is very close to Muam Nkauj Liag (in Moob Dlawb.)

Mongolie, is how it was written in French. An Moob Leeg think, it is their country! WOW!!!! How could your trust this kind of thinking without any fact?

How it is written in Chinese? I can't write the Chinese characters here, but in Pin Yin, it is Meng Gu pornounce in Hmong as, Mooj Ku!  

From this perspective, should we go with the westernized vocabulary of -lie and -lia, or should we accept the Chinese variation, without the -lie and -lia?

The Mongol themselves composed of many ancient tribes, like the Donghu, Xiongnu, Khitan etc., They never referred to themselves as Mongolian until recently! In the past, they were respectively belong only to their own tribes.

Now, tell me which of these many numerous Mogol tribes do Hmong begong to? You tell me?

I will be back for more!!

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 30 January 2010 - 12:21 PM, said:

Bro Tub Soj Ntsuam,

At this specific moment, I can't bring the piece of research in regard Hmong and Mongolia. But, I promise to bring it here when I found it. Because, I think the idea of Mongolia has anything to do with Hmong is all bullshit, and that's TRUE!


Mongolia, is how it was written in English. And Hmong think, it is very close to Muam Nkauj Liag (in Moob Dlawb.)

Mongolie, is how it was written in French. An Moob Leeg think, it is their country! WOW!!!! How could your trust this kind of thinking without any fact?

How it is written in Chinese? I can't write the Chinese characters here, but in Pin Yin, it is Meng Gu pornounce in Hmong as, Mooj Ku!  

From this perspective, should we go with the westernized vocabulary of -lie and -lia, or should we accept the Chinese variation, without the -lie and -lia?

The Mongol themselves composed of many ancient tribes, like the Donghu, Xiongnu, Khitan etc., They never referred to themselves as Mongolian until recently! In the past, they were respectively belong only to their own tribes.

Now, tell me which of these many numerous Mogol tribes do Hmong begong to? You tell me?

I will be back for more!!


Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Before I answer your question,please let me extend my story further out.

As of I've heard it,the whole story goes..
A young prince was searching for a loving wife and he came across our Hmong people. He saw Maum Nkauj Liag or
Maum Nkauj Lig then he married her and took her to his kingdom. When the two got to the prince's homeland,
his father which was the the king of that nation or so.

After they had a big celebration for them two,the king(his father)kindly asked his daughter-in-laws for her maiden name.
She replied "Maum Nkauj Liag or Maum Nkauj Lig" The king was very happy and he then gave a speech in front of a huge
crowd that he will name his kingdom after his daughter-in-laws which was Maum Nkauj Liag or Maum Nkauj Lig.

"I'm not saying that I was right but the story sounded very interesting and for some reasons it makes good sense"

Now...For your question about the root of our Hmong,I'm afraid I can not answer that because I'm not an historian.
Anyway,I like to thank you for your researched of the truth about Hmong.


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 Tub Soj Ntsuam, on 30 January 2010 - 07:45 PM, said:

Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Before I answer your question,please let me extend my story further out.

As I've heard it,the whole story goes..
A young prince was searching for a loving wife and he came across our Hmong people. He saw Maum Nkauj Liag or
Maum Nkauj Lig then he married her and took her to his kingdom. When the two got to the prince's homeland,
his father which was the the king of that nation or so.

After they had a big celebration for them two,the king(his father)kindly asked his daughter-in-laws for her maiden name.
She replied "Maum Nkauj Liag or Maum Nkauj Lig" The king was very happy and he then gave a speech in front of a huge
crowds that he will name his kingdom after his daughter-in-laws which was Maum Nkauj Liag or Maum Nkauj Lig.

"I'm not saying that I was right but the story sounded very interesting and for some reasons it makes good sense"

Now...For your question about the root of our Hmong,I'm afraid I can not answer that because I'm not an historian.
Anyway,I like to thank you for your researched of the truth about Hmong.



Bro Tub Soj Ntsuam,

At the turn of the century, the European, such as France and England had been using their respective languages to map out the world. Ts.oob Kuj - Suav - became Englicised as China, and Francolized as Chine; Because Qin Shi Huang was the emperor who unified China 400 years before the birth of Christ! Zhong Gou, however never once enter into the mind of the western bastards! They wanted to call the whole world any way they wanted and that's why!

Thailand today, used to be Siam, but the Thais called themselves, Thai - no S and no -land. Laos too, likewise never had the last consonant S. Now, do you want to call Thai simply as Thai or with an emphasis on the last consonant Thais? Do you also prefer to call Lao simply Lao, or do you go with Laos? Pronounciation in French is Lao - os!

In the case of Mongol, ia and ie have no affinity or affiliation any what so ever with Lig or Liag. I don't know why Hmong emphasizes so much about their connection with Mongol, but the western bastards never once thought of Muam Nkauj Liag or Muam Nkauj Lig. If you take away Lig or Liag (the western bastardized vocabulary) from Mongol, do we still have the meaning of a nomadic people of the Siberia steppe, as the Hmong princess Muam Nkauj.... what?

How about Malaysia, Cambodia, Indonesia, India or Phillipine?

In the ancient time, the Hmong only heard the world Mooj Ku and never even hear the word Mongolia until the Vietnam war in Laos where they see it on the map, and ever since it got stucked. Do you know who actually suggested the idea that Hmong once lived in Mongolia?

I was trying to find that exact passages in a book, where one of the US AID pilot who in 1970 or 71 happened to read Father F. M. Savina's 1924 book, Historie des Miao and try to passed on the theory to some of his Hmong friends, my uncles included!

I hope I found it soon. One last question, can you open pdf. file? Why? Because I have some interesting Hmong research in this format!

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 30 January 2010 - 10:04 PM, said:

Bro Tub Soj Ntsuam,

At the turn of the century, the European, such as France and England had been using their respective languages to map out the world. Ts.oob Kuj - Suav - became Englicised as China, and Francolized as Chine; Because Qin Shi Huang was the emperor who unified China 400 years before the birth of Christ! Zhong Gou, however never once enter into the mind of the western bastards! They wanted to call the whole world any way they wanted and that's why!

Thailand today, used to be Siam, but the Thais called themselves, Thai - no S and no -land. Laos too, likewise never had the last consonant S. Now, do you want to call Thai simply as Thai or with an emphasis on the last consonant Thais? Do you also prefer to call Lao simply Lao, or do you go with Laos? Pronounciation in French is Lao - os!

In the case of Mongol, ia and ie have no affinity or affiliation any what so ever with Lig or Liag. I don't know why Hmong emphasizes so much about their connection with Mongol, but the western bastards never once thought of Muam Nkauj Liag or Muam Nkauj Lig. If you take away Lig or Liag (the western bastardized vocabulary) from Mongol, do we still have the meaning of a nomadic people of the Siberia steppe, as the Hmong princess Muam Nkauj.... what?

How about Malaysia, Cambodia, Indonesia, India or Phillipine?

In the ancient time, the Hmong only heard the world Mooj Ku and never even hear the word Mongolia until the Vietnam war in Laos where they see it on the map, and ever since it got stucked. Do you know who actually suggested the idea that Hmong once lived in Mongolia?

I was trying to find that exact passages in a book, where one of the US AID pilot who in 1970 or 71 happened to read Father F. M. Savina's 1924 book, Historie des Miao and try to passed on the theory to some of his Hmong friends, my uncles included!

I hope I found it soon. One last question, can you open pdf. file? Why? Because I have some interesting Hmong research in this format!


Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

I once told you that I'm not an historian,I'm afraid I won't be able to answer all of your questions. I probably have to do
a lot of research before knowing the truth. My bro I have another question? Do you always believe of what was written
in the book(History written by foreigners)?

Sometime I think our elderly might have known little about our past or so call history in the beginning? As a young boy,
I love listening to folktales story told by older grown up. "I do not always believe history that was well written by
educated people"

I think I might have to travel to China someday just to have a good look at their living conditions and the culture over
there! "I believe people can change history but history can not change itself" What I would like to do is asking a lot
of questions from our elderly and maybe read some books and research for the truth like you...hehe!

Anyway,I like to give you some credits for doing all the researched. Thank you my bro.


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 Vahuamsibluag, on 09 January 2010 - 11:39 AM, said:

Tsis muaj tias Hmoob yuav qiv lus ntawm lwm haiv neeg los. Ntuj tsim teb raug Hmoob nyob qabntuj. Hmoob yeej txawj hais Hmoob lus. Chivkeeb ntiajteb tsuas muaj dej, nrojtsuag thiab blej/mov xwb. Mov je dej txias thiab je zaub tsuag yog Hmoob tug! Ib qho ntawm Hmoob txoj kev r uam yog kev xyaum testaw. Yus txawj yus tug los tseem hu ua "Kung Fu". Hmoob pluag lus kawg! :angry:


bawg vam,

loslus KUNG FU no yeej yog lus hmoob hos.  koj mloog kuv txhais rau koj nawj;

FU = FWJ ib tug yawg hu ua fwj

KUNG = Kaav, kaav theeb

tiag tiag mas yog FU KUNG testaw heev ces lawv txawm hu ua KAAV FWJ lawm no xwb.
ibyam li KAV LIAM ne, tiag tiag mas yog LIAM KAV xwb.
thiab li DAB NEEG yog NEEG DAB lawm xwb os.
:D  :D  :D HEHHHHEEHHEEHHEHEHHEE


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 Tub Soj Ntsuam, on 31 January 2010 - 06:41 AM, said:

Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

I once told you that I'm not an historian,I'm afraid I won't be able to answer all of your questions. I probably have to do
a lot of research before knowing the truth. My bro I have another question? Do you always believe of what was written
in the book(History written by foreigners)?

Sometime I think our elderly might have known little about our past or so call history in the beginning? As a young boy,
I love listening to folktales story told by older grown up. "I do not always believe history that was well written by
educated people"

I think I might have to travel to China someday just to have a good look at their living conditions and the culture over
there! "I believe people can change history but history can not change itself" What I would like to do is asking a lot
of questions from our elderly and maybe read some books and research for the truth like you...hehe!

Anyway,I like to give you some credits for doing all the researched. Thank you my bro.



Tub Soj Ntsuam,

No, bro! No body is a historian here, not me and not you bro, but someday, if I can push you enough, hehhehehe. (I always doubt if there is at least one intellectual in Hmongza!) As of now, don’t try to answer me, but you need to answer for your self.

There is a method to research and you know it, the ethical of this guideline is to remain neutral and not bias toward your hypothesis. The objective is to gather enough raw data in a large enough sample, to come very close to the fact of our intended hypothesis. And there’s no way out there I know of that will get us to the clearer picture than, the Scientific Method of researching. I, thus logically will lean more toward research facts than mere oral transmission, and yet oral transmission seem likely to be one of the source any one who endeavor to be a Hmong historian-researcher.

Before I read a book on Hmong or any other written material of interest, I would first look to the abstract and method how the author gathered his data. If he is clear and concise with his method, then I know if I go his route, what different outcome I could imagine, I would get. If some how the author had not a good method of getting his facts, I doubt the infos in his book will remain with me for long.

Hmong oral transmission had always been not very reliable, due top rote memory regression, and that brother, that mean how well the story teller remembers details in a story. As far as I know, oral transmission Hmong style had a lot inconsistency here and there. The teller simply omitted certain parts and added some new tricks somewhere along to story line, and some tellers were more creative, while other could has rov qaab rov quav, messing up like the story is nothing at all. Take for example, the story of Nkauj Ntsuab Nraug Naab, the Laotian Hmong had added The Plain of Jars, the creation of Mekong, and Chao Phraya rivers into it, where Hmong from others countries have no absolute knowledge of! Or the story of Sin sai, which now many Hmong had claimed to be originally and authentically Hmong, but as you and I know, it’s not so. Bro, you can see here BIAS played a lot in this kind of oral transmission, not to mention, the intention and how well memories were retained too!

Going to China is like going back to your soul, and I do recommend any Hmong to explore that fabric piece of our motherland. As far as research concern, you will get more confused as you gather more data, because the Hmong are never concise in anything! You will have a lot of filters to clear, before you can even see the facts. Bro you know one funny thing? Hmong in China are never Hmong, they had always been Miao Tzu, and if Western Hmong had not for the past decades been bastardized these Miao Tzu, they will still never know that they actually are Hmong!

To give you an idea, we need to listen to one Lug Nruag that has the core of Hmong spirit, and pick that story as the control sourse thesis. Now, we go get all over the various Hmong and Miao all over the world to tell this same story. Then we will analyze this story in the light. I bet you, we will had a clearer picture, and not only that, we will also see something unexpected clues here and there. And that my bro, that’s what you need to spend many lifetimes to do, to see where, who and what is Hmong.

There remain tons of facts to do, to clear this damn ignorance on anything, Hmong. I welcome all who wants to take the yoke to use the scientific method to to clear the Miao Tzu into more Hmong.

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 siabhmoob, on 31 January 2010 - 08:38 AM, said:

bawg vam,

loslus KUNG FU no yeej yog lus hmoob hos.  koj mloog kuv txhais rau koj nawj;

FU = FWJ ib tug yawg hu ua fwj

KUNG = Kaav, kaav theeb

tiag tiag mas yog FU KUNG testaw heev ces lawv txawm hu ua KAAV FWJ lawm no xwb.
ibyam li KAV LIAM ne, tiag tiag mas yog LIAM KAV xwb.
thiab li DAB NEEG yog NEEG DAB lawm xwb os.
:D  :D  :D HEHHHHEEHHEEHHEHEHHEE


Siab Hmoob,

Tsi laam luag ov..... kuv yeej xaav le koj has hab tag!
Suav has lug rovqaab lug Moob... Moob has, "Zoo heev" Moob Suav los yog
Suav has tas, "Heev zoo."

Moob has tas Moob Dlawb, Suav has tas Bai Miao (Paig Moob = Moob Paig)!

Kung Fu, lug Suav txhais has tas Ua haujlwm nyaav (hard work) = Fwv Nyaav.

puas yog mad??

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Tub Soj Ntsuam

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 31 January 2010 - 11:10 AM, said:

Tub Soj Ntsuam,

No, bro! No body is a historian here, not me and not you bro, but someday, if I can push you enough, hehhehehe. (I always doubt if there is at least one intellectual in Hmongza!) As of now, don’t try to answer me, but you need to answer for your self.

There is a method to research and you know it, the ethical of this guideline is to remain neutral and not bias toward your hypothesis. The objective is to gather enough raw data in a large enough sample, to come very close to the fact of our intended hypothesis. And there’s no way out there I know of that will get us to the clearer picture than, the Scientific Method of researching. I, thus logically will lean more toward research facts than mere oral transmission, and yet oral transmission seem likely to be one of the source any one who endeavor to be a Hmong historian-researcher.

Before I read a book on Hmong or any other written material of interest, I would first look to the abstract and method how the author gathered his data. If he is clear and concise with his method, then I know if I go his route, what different outcome I could imagine, I would get. If some how the author had not a good method of getting his facts, I doubt the infos in his book will remain with me for long.

Hmong oral transmission had always been not very reliable, due top rote memory regression, and that brother, that mean how well the story teller remembers details in a story. As far as I know, oral transmission Hmong style had a lot inconsistency here and there. The teller simply omitted certain parts and added some new tricks somewhere along to story line, and some tellers were more creative, while other could has rov qaab rov quav, messing up like the story is nothing at all. Take for example, the story of Nkauj Ntsuab Nraug Naab, the Laotian Hmong had added The Plain of Jars, the creation of Mekong, and Chao Phraya rivers into it, where Hmong from others countries have no absolute knowledge of! Or the story of Sin sai, which now many Hmong had claimed to be originally and authentically Hmong, but as you and I know, it’s not so. Bro, you can see here BIAS played a lot in this kind of oral transmission, not to mention, the intention and how well memories were retained too!

Going to China is like going back to your soul, and I do recommend any Hmong to explore that fabric piece of our motherland. As far as research concern, you will get more confused as you gather more data, because the Hmong are never concise in anything! You will have a lot of filters to clear, before you can even see the facts. Bro you know one funny thing? Hmong in China are never Hmong, they had always been Miao Tzu, and if Western Hmong had not for the past decades been bastardized these Miao Tzu, they will still never know that they actually are Hmong!

To give you an idea, we need to listen to one Lug Nruag that has the core of Hmong spirit, and pick that story as the control sourse thesis. Now, we go get all over the various Hmong and Miao all over the world to tell this same story. Then we will analyze this story in the light. I bet you, we will had a clearer picture, and not only that, we will also see something unexpected clues here and there. And that my bro, that’s what you need to spend many lifetimes to do, to see where, who and what is Hmong.

There remain tons of facts to do, to clear this damn ignorance on anything, Hmong. I welcome all who wants to take the yoke to use the scientific method to to clear the Miao Tzu into more Hmong.



Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Wow! You're like Mike Tyson the heavy weigh boxer..hehe! I only threw one swing and you're punching over a hundred speed knockout
punched...hehe! Anyway,your theories make sense somewhat but I will still have to see with my own two eyes.

By going over to China will give me an idea of how civilization is like over there. I knew that I won't get all the answers because
like I once said earlier."People did change history when times pass over"

I have a last question? Are you a teacher? You seemed to know your subject! From now on,I like to see you gather as much facts as
you possibly can to Hmongza,so me and the rest can learn from you...hehe! Have a nice day! Thanks.


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 Tub Soj Ntsuam, on 31 January 2010 - 01:55 PM, said:


Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Wow! You're like Mike Tyson the heavy weigh boxer..hehe! I only threw one swing and you're punching over a hundred speed knockout
punched...hehe! Anyway,your theories make sense somewhat but I will still have to see with my own two eyes.

By going over to China will give me an idea of how civilization is like over there. I knew that I won't get all the answers because
like I once said earlier."People did change history when times pass over"

I have a last question? Are you a teacher? You seemed to know your subject! From now on,I like to see you gather as much facts as
you possibly can to Hmongza,so me and the rest can learn from you...hehe! Have a nice day! Thanks.


Tub Soj Ntsuam bro,

Go bro..... go to China, you might be too late now for the new year, Tiger!
I am not a teacher, can't stand people who don't, and or can't learn by themselves.

Here is the Chinese characters for Mongol, and as you can see, there
is no -lia, or lie!

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Tub Soj Ntsuam

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 31 January 2010 - 10:39 PM, said:

Tub Soj Ntsuam bro,

Go bro..... go to China, you might be too late now for the new year, Tiger!
I am not a teacher, can't stand people who don't, and or can't learn by themselves.

Here is the Chinese characters for Mongol, and as you can see, there
is no -lia, or lie!



Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Tug phooj ywg kuv tsis yog xaav nrug koj sis caav nawb mog. Kuv tsuas nug txug ntawm Moob tug ntxhais kws
"Maum Nkauj Lag(liag) or Maum Nkauj Lig" nkaus xwb. Taab sis koj pheej moog has ntau tsaav ntau yaam piv txwv.

"I only focus on a single subject but you're flying all over the world" This is the end of my discussion with
you my bro. "No offensive" I'm out! Thank you. Have a wonderful day.


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 Tub Soj Ntsuam, on 01 February 2010 - 06:51 PM, said:

Chiv Keeb Fuam Yuaj,

Tug phooj ywg kuv tsis yog xaav nrug koj sis caav nawb mog. Kuv tsuas nug txug ntawm Moob tug ntxhais kws
"Maum Nkauj Lag(liag) or Maum Nkauj Lig" nkaus xwb. Taab sis koj pheej moog has ntau tsaav ntau yaam piv txwv.

"I only focus on a single subject but you're flying all over the world" This is the end of my discussion with
you my bro. "No offensive" I'm out! Thank you. Have a wonderful day.


Tub Soj Ntsuam,
Wow…  can’t figure out how my response could affect you so negatively?
Let me see....


"Tub Soj Ntsuam bro,

Go bro..... go to China, you might be too late now for the new year, Tiger!
I am not a teacher, can't stand people who don't, and or can't learn by themselves.

Here is the Chinese characters for Mongol, and as you can see, there
is no -lia, or lie!"

1. Maybe you were down a bad mood or something... I used the word Tiger here, because it is the Chinese year of the Tiger! And now the Chinese are ready to celebrate it... matter of fact it is too late to go now!
2. Maybe because, I said I can’t stand people who don’t... to answer you that I am not a teacher, and it’s true I am not a teacher, because I am by nature not patient enough to teach little kids, high school or even colleges students. I never want to teach!
3. I presented to you the Chinese character only to further the discussion in a better light.

Wow, I am still dazed... consider your intelligence and your creative mind, and still you took this one paragraph of imperfect English to such extremity.... You really floored me, it knocked me out bro!

I believe I didn’t have anything negative or even offensive with or against you. Not one wrong thought was on my mind when I wrote it. If the wording, or even the tone, in my response to you did somehow come across as aggressively arrogant, it was never intended. If somehow, the nature of the language made it seem too bastardize to you, blame it on my ignorance of my choice of words.

Now, I can’t still see how these wording affected my newfound friend so much as to severe all tie. Emotion aside if that’s how you gonna take it, I consider it as a potential good friend lost.

I will never know if deep inside of you resided the heart to care enough to come back around for my explanations, but if someday in the future you do calm down and feel differently, I will still always be happy to welcome any engagement with you joyfully.

If all this is because of my personality, that you can’t stand it so.... it’s all good, bro.... the adieu will be good for you!

I am truly sorry that you take it the way it was never intended, but do thank you and have a very nice day for the rest of your day.

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 maixiong_vg, on 30 January 2010 - 09:39 AM, said:

Bro yog ke koj yuav moog ua research txug moob tej kaab lis kev cai rua peg tuam tshoj nuav zoo kawg mas, txawm kuv yuav paab kooj daab tsis tsis tau los txhob ua sab deb hab thaum twg koj phau ntawv tav lawm ncu ntsoov copy ib phoo pub rua kuv hab nawb.

Tus Bro aw! tej thaum yug expect daab tsis zog lawm kuj yuav hopeless hav, yuav tsum txhob expect ntau ntau txhaj le ntsib huas hab txha le tsis hawb hawb os :lol:

Bro kojlub Topic SPIRITUAL AWAKENING nybo qhov twg nej?

Maivxiong_vg,

Sov tem ua caag kuv nhrav tsi tau kuv lub topic: Spiritual awakening le lawm hab tag. Kuv tuaj nhrav pistsawg zag los cale nrhav tsi pum le lawm, puas yog koj muab coj moog puag pw lawm ne?

Paab kuv nrhav hab mad lod? Tej zag meb yuav tau ua ib qho option SEARCH ruas cov nrhav tsi tau nwg qhov topic lawm pob, puas ua tau le ntawm mad?

http://www.hmongza.c...tual-awakening/


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Kwv tij hmoob yog koj tsis paub ntawv hmoob kuv mam qhia koj......

   ntawm koj sau JE thiab dej...Je.> txhais tias ME nawb vim koj.
  
   sau JE mas sau li no  NTSES os mog,koj sau JE li no ces yog lus FRANCE
  
   lwm zaus txhob sau li ko mog

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 3HMOOB, on 08 February 2010 - 07:52 AM, said:

Kwv tij hmoob yog koj tsis paub ntawv hmoob kuv mam qhia koj......

   ntawm koj sau JE thiab dej...Je.> txhais tias ME nawb vim koj.
  
   sau JE mas sau li no  NTSES os mog,koj sau JE li no ces yog lus FRANCE
  
   lwm zaus txhob sau li ko mog

Kwvtij,

Naim no Hmoob txawj txawg tsim ntawv Hmoob li lawm ov, tus yuav sau li cas los yeej muaj tag li nawb. Cov sau Ntses ua Je, sau Npaub ua Baob, sau lwj sau liam xav sau li cas ces cia li sau li lawm tsis muaj ib tug standard dabtsi li. Li no thiaj hais tias Hmoob tsis muaj cai, tsis siv cai no los mas. Hmoob ywj siab ywj ntswj zij poj niam li cas ces, lawv lam tau lam ua tib yam li ntawd li ntag.

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    Nyob zoo txais tos sawv daws los ua phooj ywg :)

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 ChivKeebFuamYuaj, on 03 February 2010 - 10:20 PM, said:

Maivxiong_vg,

Sov tem ua caag kuv nhrav tsi tau kuv lub topic: Spiritual awakening le lawm hab tag. Kuv tuaj nhrav pistsawg zag los cale nrhav tsi pum le lawm, puas yog koj muab coj moog puag pw lawm ne?

Paab kuv nrhav hab mad lod? Tej zag meb yuav tau ua ib qho option SEARCH ruas cov nrhav tsi tau nwg qhov topic lawm pob, puas ua tau le ntawm mad?

http://www.hmongza.c...tual-awakening/



Ntshe ho yog kuv coj moog puag pw tsis ncu saib lawm xwb tag pob :lol:

Bro tau kawg mas, koj moog nas koj qhov Profile sau koj lub npe right top corner ces koj mam moog nas ntawm "Find Topic" los sis "Find Post" huv qaab koj daim dual tom saab laug ces yeej tawm tuaj taag le os.
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